...partially because I just needed some unbiased encouragement and advice, and partially to see if he had any leads.
He told me that quite honestly, if he were in my shoes, he'd be looking for a new place to minister. And gave me a lead, apart from the FT one I'm pursuing. This one is only PT - but I still left a message with their senior pastor (a former children's pastor, and a good friend of my CE director). A lot of "part time" children's ministry positions still pay pretty well, so I'm not going to be completely closed-minded before I even talk to them. This one is also looking for a worship leader, and my DH would be great at that (he already told me that is something he'd be willing to do!)...
Simply put, I think it's time for me to start looking elsewhere. We had a meeting after the service on Sunday for our Halloween outreach coming up, and we had four people show up. I'm tired of fighting for everything in that place. If they don't want a children's pastor, then they just won't have one. As my CE director told me today, "I know you're called and gifted, and you are worthy of a paycheck."
I told him I'd stay and work for nothing if I knew they wanted me there. And he said, "I've been there, too, and I totally understand that."
It makes me sad, because I know that I was called there. But as I told YP the other day, "I think I'm at the 'shake the dust off my feet' point in my ministry here."
She said, "I've been feeling that way about you for a long time. You need to get the heck out of here." She and her husband have been feeling that way for awhile, and are both excited that there are opportunities in the area so we'll stay. It's funny - I've been freaking out and worrying that they'll leave the area, and they've been worrying that we'll leave. Good friends, especially in the ministry, are hard to come by. But we're all staying. We just most likely won't be working together in the same church anymore...
On that note...from those of you who are SP's or wives of SP's: When is the appropriate time for a staff member to tell their SP that they are leaving? Before they actually get an offer (to give them a "heads up"), or not until something is finalized? I mean, here I am, about to be "appreciated" this Sunday, and I've just contacted two other churches in the area...
I don't plan to discuss this with the board. My resignation will be submitted to my SP only, since he's the one who hired me - and this is the part I'm dreading the most, because I do love that man. But when I talked to my CE director, I said that I've been thinking over and over again, "Is ministry supposed to be this hard? Is it really supposed to be like this?" He said that chances are, if you're asking yourself those questions, the answer is no.
And yes, I DO plan, regardless of when I leave, to go out with a bang! I have a gigantic activity night planned for next Wednesday ("Fear Factor" night, complete with fake barf - the theme is "garbage in, garbage out."), and of course, the community Halloween event that DH and I orchestrated (this year is the 2nd annual!), along with four other churches.
I plan to walk out of that place with my head held high, knowing that I am a fabulous children's pastor, and that I did everything in my power to fulfill my ministry philosophy: To introduce kids to Jesus and give them the tools to have their very own relationship with Him!!!
So, pray for me...that I will find the right match - needs to be close to where I live now - and that I will continue to follow the Lord's leading in my ministry...
I think things vary from pastor to pastor, as to whether they want to know beforehand or once you know definitely. I asked my husband this question just now - he said it totally depends on his relationship with the staff person. If he is close to them, he would prefer to know beforehand and would more than likely completely understand the move - provided it's the right move. For instance, has the person really prayed through on it and is it a wise move? We had a staff person in the past who said they were going on staff somewhere to be a FT pastor of evangelism. My husband said, "Okay, how many people have you won to the Lord in the past year?" The staff person said, "none." My husband said, "I would seriously question WHY you are making this move." It made no sense. My dh would completely understand if it was a "next level" move and the staff person were moving on to a promotion of sorts . My dh also said that if the person was taking a district position or such, he would want to know - and not be surprised by it, such as at district council, etc. Now that would be REALLY bad. If we are close to the person we would want to know. If the staff and my dh are not particularly close, he would just want them to tell us when all the arrangements have been made...then we would just do the two week transition period and that would be that. My dh does not ever extend things beyond 2 weeks...feels it's unhealthy. We would not personally (he and I) ever do beyond 2 weeks for our own selves, and we would not want it from a staff person. It just prolongs things. It's better to get on with it...
With me personally, I probably would not want to know at all even if I was close to the person. I differ from dh a little in that...I wouldn't want to agonize over it if I was close to them (get the transition over as quickly as possible.) And, if I am not close to them at all, the time of waiting would probably drive me crazy! So, I would rather just not know.
You are handling this the right way, Puppetmaster. Go out with a bang and just keep doing what you are doing.
About the "is the ministry supposed to be like this" I do sort of take a different view from your CE Director. I feel like difficulties and persecution are just a given. The Apostle Paul faced it...who are we to think we won't deal with hardships? The ministry is not a picnic for anybody. I just don't want you to think it would be free of all this in another church. you are in a difficult, abusive church. But please understand that all churches have "problem people" and unique situations. Some less than others, but no church is void of them.
I absolutely know, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that there are "problem" people in every church...
My former senior pastor is at a "dream" church right now - where the people really love him and his wife and take care of them and respect them, and even he is dealing with a problem situation right now.
A friend and I, on one crazy day at the beach in college (we were watching his younger sisters while they swam and were bored!) came up with a church that we called "Utopian A/G." We planned it out to the last detail - we came up with the perfect staff, the perfect facilities - everything! Then we said, "Yeah, but now we have to let the people inside, and it won't be Utopia anymore!"
I'm definitely not afraid of difficult people or situations - I'm from Northern Minnesota, lol - most of my relatives are difficult people .
The difficult, abusive attitude in our church is just one strike against it. The other strike is that I am basically working two full time jobs for one full time salary, and there is absolutely no end in sight to that if I stay where I am. I could even deal with that, but I feel like I've been fighting and working my tail off for a church that doesn't really want me there (aside from the other pastors!). I am called to be a children's pastor - not an administrative assistant who does children's ministry on the side, and first and foremost I am called to my husband and to the children we hope to have someday.
As my DH said, "We've spent our lives catering to what is best for everyone else. It's time for us to start thinking about what's best for us and our future family."
I could be spiritual about it and say that "The Lord is leading me in new directions," and in a way, I think He is! I had a lady give a prophetic word over me last May, and I have been trying to figure out what she meant ever since...she said, "To everything there is a season. To stay in the winter when God is trying to move you into spring will hinder His plan for your life."
So, you are saying watch out for Northern Minnesota people? (I never even realized the danger...)
I agree, you need to move on. I really believe if you sense your church as a whole does not want you there, then it's just not a positive environment for you. Like I said before, you need to go where you are celebrated, not tolerated.
I really feel directed to tell you that the Lord is preparing a table for you in the presence of your enemies. Get ready!
In response to your question to SP's puppetmaster, we prefer knowing ahead and working with the staff person in finding God's will. However, if they were a problem person(divisive, moral failure, trouble maker, etc.) we would ask for their resignation. They would be expected to leave ASAP.
I do not know the context of your situation. But if you are planning to stay in the same geographical area, it would be wise to have a plan on how to stop runaway gossip.A great book by a minister Michael Sedler is : Stop Runaway Conversations . And a plan how to leave with integrity, dignity and loyalty to your SP needs to be in place.
I've seen SP's respond differently to an honest approach. Some let you go before you have anything lined up. I don't agree with that especially if you are not a troublemaker and the job's your livelihood. I do think the avg. pay you heard for CP is a rather lofty one because the statistics from Dobson's ministry suggest that Sr. Pastors are highly underpaid and average churches can't afford a full staff. Nonetheless, there are exceptions. I will pray for you, Priscilla 2
So, you are saying watch out for Northern Minnesota people? (I never even realized the danger...) I agree, you need to move on. I really believe if you sense your church as a whole does not want you there, then it's just not a positive environment for you. Like I said before, you need to go where you are celebrated, not tolerated. I really feel directed to tell you that the Lord is preparing a table for you in the presence of your enemies. Get ready!
As I said in a previous post, check out the movie "North Country" - it promises to give the entire nation a real insight as to the town that I (and so many others, obviously ) grew up in!! My grandfather was actually the general foreman at the mine that this movie takes place in (not during the actual harrassment, lol!), so I did grow up with a bunch of "rough" miner types...
Deanna, there is a reason that God told you to tell me that. A couple of days ago, I prayed part of the 23rd Psalm as I was crying out and asking God for direction. I actually prayed, "God, prepare a table before me in the presence of my enemies."
And when I got home from Youth Convention this weekend (the things I do for my friends ), I checked my messages and there was a voice mail from...hmm...I don't think I'm going to name the person, just for confidentiality reasons, but let's just say that he is an extremely well-known pastor (well known for all the good reasons - other pastors I've talked to strongly encouraged me to apply, and some have even asked, "Is he hiring a youth pastor/music pastor/janitor/anything?") to whose church I sent my resume. Anyway, he wants to contact me this week to set up an interview!!! Doing the happy dance right now. You ladies are the first to hear about this - it's 9:00 in the morning and DH is still asleep, and I'm sure YP is, too (I'm the nerd who can't sleep in after an exhausting weekend!!).
Sorry...I'm rambling now.
Just have to get through Pastor's Appreciation Day tomorrow - I think it's going to be bittersweet for me. Fortunately, the majority of "my" kids come on Wednesday nights. Unfortunately, my SP is obviously there on Sundays. I know that he won't hold anything against me or be mad at me, but I feel like I'd be beating a black lab puppy. He's so excited about everything, and his enthusiasm and optimism have been what have kept me there longer than I should have stayed. I know we'll stay friends with him and his family - that's a given...it'll be all right..
'Cause I know my God saved the day, and I know His word never fails, and I know my God made a way for me...SALVATION IS HERE!! (Can you tell I just got back from Youth Convention or what?!?!?)
Priscilla, I know that not EVERY children's pastor starts out at $40,000 a year, but in the past several years, every single CM major from North Central (where I currently work) has stepped into an extremely generous full time salary - not all at huge churches, either...I'm searching for the happy medium between $40K-$50K and $100/week. There's got to be one .
Keep a big smile and your chin up! It is hard to find Children's Pastors who really have a heart for kids. I admire those called to work with children
We need a CP right now so I covet your prayers too! Perhaps there is a difference in pay (North vs. South:) I do not know but I do know that for us, starting out in ministry and even 15 years later, God has supplied all our needs. Salary was never a motivator. We started out as YP's for peanuts! (well, not exactly) But it was very little to get by on and even as SP we started out 10 grand less than what you heard CP's in your area make. I will pray that the right doors will open for you and you can use your gifts/talents to their fullest potential to win and keep kids for Christ!
There are a lot of factors calculated. Church debt? Tithers? Cost of living? We personally never tried to keep up with the Jones' or got caught up in materialism. We don't do debt. God is a great provider! Do your best, leave Him to the rest! Do what's right and it'll be alright! Keep your eyes on God not humans. He is the WAYMAKER!
- the theme is "garbage in, garbage out."), and of course, the community Halloween event that DH and I orchestrated (this year is the 2nd annual!), along with four other churches. 
), I checked my messages and there was a voice mail from...hmm...I don't think I'm going to name the person, just for confidentiality reasons, but let's just say that he is an extremely well-known pastor (well known for all the good reasons - other pastors I've talked to strongly encouraged me to apply, and some have even asked, "Is he hiring a youth pastor/music pastor/janitor/anything?") to whose church I sent my resume. Anyway, he wants to contact me this week to set up an interview!!! Doing the happy dance right now. You ladies are the first to hear about this - it's 9:00 in the morning and DH is still asleep, and I'm sure YP is, too (I'm the nerd who can't sleep in after an exhausting weekend!!).
